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Three 1:24 Windsor Chairs

by PrettySmallThings, published

Three 1:24 Windsor Chairs by PrettySmallThings Apr 24, 2012

Featured Thing!

Description

Three variations on the Windsor chair in 1:24 scale: low back, fan back and sack back. There are designed to be built without support. Delicate but surprisingly sturdy. Shown with a dime for scale.

There's a short time-lapse here: flic.kr/p/bQpBB8

Recent Comments

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Thank you so much. I knew you must have had a good reason for the discrepancy in the conversion chart . I have some " in between " items so the 1.06 multiplier will come in handy for my purposes. And your right. It is closer to 1.58. I was rounding a little bit myself. :)
The values on my scale charts are rounded off. I don't use 1" as a multiplier exactly, it's just how I think about values less than 1' while I'm modeling. I tend to use the whole chart - if I need something 10', grab that value and use it, rather than multiplying 1.06 by the number of inches (120) - but if a multiplier feels right to you - go for it. I usually don't model out to two decimal points, unless I'm planning for layer width or thread width.

1.06 as a multiplier seems to work well up to about 20', I think the value is closer to 1.058 - and it starts to add up after awhile. After 20' in 1:24, objects won't fit on many printers anyhow - so it doesn't much matter.
I'm sure there is a reason for this but on your 1:24 scale if I use 1"=1.06mm instead of 1mm it works out better for 12 inches to =12.7mm ect, ect.
Am I missing something? Can I just use 1.06 as a multiplier without using the equation?

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Instructions

I'm running skeinforge 47 on a Replicator and needed to make the following adjustments to the stock profile:
*Under Dimension, set "Extra Restart Distance" to 0
*I print these in pairs, to give the print cooling time without waisting time. I prefer printing them in a line along the y axis instead of side by side to keep my second extruder from interfering.
*35mm/s works well for me, 40mm/s travel
*These are designed for printing at .25mm layer height. The bridges are carefully designed in and I can't guarantee this will print at other slicing heights.
*The file includes small discs under each chair leg. A raft is unnecessary.
Thank you so much. I knew you must have had a good reason for the discrepancy in the conversion chart . I have some " in between " items so the 1.06 multiplier will come in handy for my purposes. And your right. It is closer to 1.58. I was rounding a little bit myself. :)
I'm sure there is a reason for this but on your 1:24 scale if I use 1"=1.06mm instead of 1mm it works out better for 12 inches to =12.7mm ect, ect.
Am I missing something? Can I just use 1.06 as a multiplier without using the equation?
The values on my scale charts are rounded off. I don't use 1" as a multiplier exactly, it's just how I think about values less than 1' while I'm modeling. I tend to use the whole chart - if I need something 10', grab that value and use it, rather than multiplying 1.06 by the number of inches (120) - but if a multiplier feels right to you - go for it. I usually don't model out to two decimal points, unless I'm planning for layer width or thread width.

1.06 as a multiplier seems to work well up to about 20', I think the value is closer to 1.058 - and it starts to add up after awhile. After 20' in 1:24, objects won't fit on many printers anyhow - so it doesn't much matter.
Hy! I printed the secound chair. I use Cura with Prusa mendel. 0.2 layer height from PLA 205°C. It's almost good but i think I will have to play with the setup parameters a littel bit. Good stuff!

Here is a picture:
http://sphotos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/483818_131975600314125_1491015723_n.jpg
Absolutely stunning! I'd picked out a number of benchmark objects to test my calibrations on my mendel and this is one of the most beautiful (and most delicate to print too!)

Thank you for uploading this, as the finished objects have such a wow factor! Perfect for class demonstrations!
Looks like you're using some type of Reprap. I have a Prusa - any pointers on getting prints of this quality? Currently there is absolutely no way I can print something this delicate and detailed! :-[
I'm no expert, but all I've been doing is refining my calibration and configuration - both in software (setting steps-per-mm for x,y,z and e, speeds, etc) and mechanically (correct belt tension, oiling, rigid frame, etc)

I used Slic3r and did 0.25mm layers, with a minimum layer time of 15s (default if cooling is on) and near to default speeds (30mm perimeters, etc) IIRC. This is using the latest Marlin rc on Gen6 electronics.
Slic3r cant slic this properly. You get up to the seat itself, but the spindles for the backs of the chairs are simply not present. Any ideas?
I don't have any experience with slic3r. Someone mentioned earlier in the comments here that slic3r has difficulty with small diameters - the minimum in this print is 1.2mm. I'm sorry I can't be of much help. Anyone else have any ideas?
I tried to print these before I realized Slic3r did not make any G-Code (mostly) for the backs of the Chairs.

I am Skeinforge Agnostic myself. I don't believe in it ;)

Slic3r is my"go-to" tool. I am tinkering with KISSlicer now too.

I will post this kind of problem as an "issue" on the Slic3r Github page.
Created "Issue" on slic3r GitHub: github.com/alexrj/Slic3r/issues/351
It appears that the latest "Dev" version of slic3r (v. 7.3) works with this model. The problem appears to be solved :)
Fantastic work! Wish I could get my Replicator to achieve this. Every attempt at printing this ends in total failure. I tried the settings you listed but no luck.

Any chance you could upload your Gcode file? I would like to see if a known good Gcode file works on my machine. If it does then it means there is some other Skeinforge settng I need to tweak on mine.

I know these things are pushing the envelope but you've shown it can be done, now I want to b
e able to do it too!

Thx!
I sent you a message. I'm interested to hear exactly how the print is failing. I'd double check that your print-o-matic settings are at the defaults to start. You need really good adhesion in the first layer, so try raising the HBP temp to 110. Maybe re-level your print bed, and move your nozzle a bit closer to the build plate. Even though this design pushes the envelope, you should be able to print without much trouble on a Replicator. Are you using ABS? Natural or a color? MBI plastic or from somewhere else? Get in touch!
My print gets to just above the stringers on the legs and then one by one the nozzle knocks over the legs. Meanwhile the print quality of the legs is very poor, no detail at all.

I set restart distance to 0, layer height to 0.25mm, Feed rate 35, Travel 40, Fill 100%, Bed Temp 100C. I am using ABS from Makerbot.

I am going to try fill 30% and bed temp 110C and see how that does.

What is your fill %?

BTW thanks a lot for your help and feedback.
Success! 30% fill and bed temp 110C.

It seems to me the algorithm for fill should let me do 100% but it overfills the layers causing them to be taller then the layer height. Then the nozzle hits them and knocks them over.

Thanks for your help. Now I am even more impressed with my Replicator!

I would like to see Thingiverse adopt
a settings template so that machine owners could fill in the critical settings along with their creations. The stl is not enough in my opinion for others to be successful right away.

Anyways, thanks again and great job! I look forward to you next creation.
Glad you got everything worked out. I usually only use 5-10% on these. Truthfully, there's very little area to fill, so I'm sure it doesn't make much difference as long as you don't use 100%. Thanks for uploading your successes!
Great stuff, as always! Impressive how good those flimsy parts came out :)
Wonderful designs. I like that you are really pushing the envelope with these!

I think it adds to the challenge and fun to design things under those kinds of constraints, like single piece with no support :).
These are great! :)

Looks like a Nakashima Conoid Chair could join the party!
I can't print these, it just turns into a birds nest. :(
:( I'm sure you're not the only one. I don't think my TOM would be up for the challenge.
This is a great torture test for Ultimaker owners, the constant pressure in the filament tube makes tiny towers like these really tricky to print without stringing all over and crashing into the towers hard enough to snap them. :)

End result was way better than expected, though!
Challenge accepted...
Wow, the tiny thin columns in the backs are impressive to print so well.
1.2mm diameter. I'm a little surprised myself - I'd never ventured below 2mm for towering like this. I need to adjust how I think about small details - these babies make the rest of my pieces look chunky and over scale!
how is it able to print the stretchers and top rails without drooping? these are awesome and great for demonstrating the abilities of the machine
3D printers can do bridges pretty easily - there are lots of bridge test objects on thingiverse that span much longer distances. It's about balancing temperature and speed to get a line that doesn't droop (or does, if that's what you're after.) You need to design your object to follow two rules: 1. You can print in mid-air, but it needs to start and end on something in order to work. 2. Only bridge in one direction at a time. If you look carefully at the STL or time-lapse, you'll notice the front to back stretchers are printed first. On the next layer, the middle stretcher is added. Same idea for the bridging that starts the seat of the chair. Side to side is accomplished in one layer, front to back in the next.

The "hoop" on the sack back follows the 45 degree rule until the very top. In general, ellipses and circles will print okay. It can get a little sloppy near the end, but the shape starts bridging about at the point it would otherwise fail.

These chairs don't break the rules - they just exploit
them :)
2. Only bridge in one direction at a time.

That is purely a limitation of Skeinforge - i believe Slic3r looks at each bridge individually. However, i don't know how well Slic3r would do with all those tiny details, it's known not to handle small features well.

Anyways, impressive design and awesome print quality! :)
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