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Axe Z pour smartrapCore (alternative Z axis)

by andreasL, published

Axe Z pour smartrapCore (alternative Z axis) by andreasL Jun 24, 2015
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Summary

Un nouvel axe Z pour la smartcore, sans porte à faux

possibilité d'utiliser un hot bed MK2 . Verre de 22cm de coté.

This new Z axis for the smartcore should improve the bed stability,
It's compatible with a MK2 bed.

The glass plate is assumed to be the one provided with the Smartfriendz kit ( 22cm square )

This design shoult work with any box based Core XY ! Let me know by posting in "I made one" !

02/12/2015
légère modification de la poulie
Light tweeking of the bearing spool

30/11/2015
MAJ importante : réalignement complet suite au passage à des poulies sur les pièces UP
Réimprimez TOUT, ou rien ! ( sauf accessoires)
Ajout des pièces "optional bearing" pour monter un roulement sur un des trous de fixation du nema 17 afin d'améliorer l'enroulement autour de la poulie moteur.
(Tous les Sliders ont été mis a jour)
Les poulies ( bearing spool) sont à imprimer en scalant un peut (101~102%), faites des tests avant de lancer un batch complet !

Important Update: Complet realignment of the geometry after adding spools on the Up bearings. Re-print the whole set or nothing ! (exept accessories)
Added "optional bearing" parts , which you may fix to one of the NEMA's fixation hole to maximize the belt grip around the motor spool .(see picture)
(every sliders are up to date)
Spools may need some scale up (101~102%). Test print before launching the full set !!!

30/10/2015
julien nous a fait une version "poulies" des pièces top. http://talk.smartfri.odns.fr/index.php?topic=668.0
Plus de déraillement de la courroie ;)

Thx to julien (http://talk.smartfri.odns.fr/index.php?topic=668.0) , tops part now works with spools, wich makes the system more reliable !

-10/08/2015
UP L&R modifié : trous de fiaxation
Afin de pouvoir garantir l'alignement des poulies, on peut désormais régler l'inclinaison de ces pièces. utiliser une rondelle pour le plus gros trou.

update on UP L&R parts : fixation holes.
Some misalignment conducted in the belt to slide sideways of the bb. With this update it's now possible to finetune the alignment.,
Use a washer with the bigger hole.

Instructions

Part list :

4 more std bearings (5 in all)
4 M8 20 screw
1 d8
20 mm Stub ( blb axis near the motor)
2x d8 * 245 mm Stub
4 LM08 bearings
1.65m Gt2 belt

optional bearing :
1x bearing
1x M3*20 screw

-Placez les pièces up et corner a 136mm du fond de la boite.
Up and Corner parts should be at 136mm from the botom of the box.

Imprimez 3 poulies (pour les roulements supérieurs et le roulement optionnel)
Print 3 spools ( upper bearings ans optional one)

There is a picture with some dimentions for you to drill your wood bed at the right places.

Please note that the bruno bellamy's landing gear is an option, and that you will find it here : http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:968461

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Hi, Andreas

I have a pair of 10mm rods ready for use, are your files adjustable that I can use these along with LM10 bearings? If not, could you rebuild the affected parts, please?

Thanks!

Just use the lm10 sliders instead of the standards ones ;)

Can you post the step or solidwork files? Or even Onshape files so that I can edit these designs?

I'm building the smartcore printer using 500 mm rods in x,y and z, so my print area is going to be about 400 x 400, but i think that i'm going to be in troubles because the bed support + bed will be too heavy, and the pulley will no have traction using the original z support.

Can i use the original support combined with your enhanced one to get more lift up?

not sure what "enhanced ones" you're talking about.
You can put two motors corners and wire them juste like you would do on a i3. This should provide you a lot of lift power !

Hi Andreas, i mean your alternative z axis

Comments deleted.

hey andreas as I am self sourcing and building wooden smartrapcore can you tell me smooth rod lengths for this
by the way m building 300x300x300 printer, I just increased wall and xy rod sizes by 100mm so I can do the same with z rod
thx

Comments deleted.
Jul 21, 2016 - Modified Aug 5, 2016

can I use this with 300x300x300 wooden smartrapcore without modifying anything except rod lengths
EDIT: thx ,yeah will try

Jul 21, 2016 - Modified Jul 21, 2016
andreasL - in reply to princesupernoah

Yes you can, but make sure to have a very light wooden frame , llike some 5mm mdf.

Have fun !

Edit : make sure the rods are 10mm in diameter !

thinking about using this kind of z axis in my own machine, kind of similar design to the smartrapcore, and wondering why does the frame weight matter? Thanks, this is a really cool z axis idea!

Using an heavy frame might conduct to have the stepper missing some steps !
A light frame will ease the work of the motor :)

ok! thanks for the quick response! do you have any videos anywhere of this system working?

I have never done any...
Maybe Bruno Bellamy posted some on YouTube...

Won't those bed support parts melt if you're printing abs on a heated bed and those parts were printed in pla?

They will ! But I avent been using a hot bed since a looong time.... I Woolf recomend you to use some metalic screw to dix your hotbed on the woodbed

This is my version of this excellent design for the Smartrapcore Alu - http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1417053

AndreasL Dual z axis Smartrapcore ALU DjDemonD remix for 2020 with counterweight

Hi, I am working on a remix of this for the Alu version. Are you happy for me to publish it - if it works, with proper attribution? I intend to only remix the parts that would be different i.e. the top and bottom brackets. I have some designs together and am planning to test it over the next few days.

a friend of mine is working on an adaptation kit for the smartrapcore alu, using only the original design, it it's easier to keep upgrading without fusther modifications.
It souhld be released at the end of the week !
If you feel like it, you can publish your work too :)

I'm very interested in the adaptation kit !!

Do you plan to do a version compatible with the SmartrapCore Alu?

You can find some bed clippers, which are more optimised to clip or remove the glass bed

http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1308938

Another idea - as you can see in my "I made it photo", I'm using top parts upside down and swapped L and R. This way I can get like 5mm more of Z axis travel - I have a led strip glued on the top of the box, so if I use your parts the correct way - they'll be overlapping with the led strip or I'll have to move it a tad down, shortening the Z axis travel a bit. On the other hand there is a drawback this way - one of the screews is not easily accessible (it is behind the belt).

As a hint - could you provide the best acceleration, feedrate and Z homing speed? I've asked Bruno on the forum about it, but it would be great to gather all the info and paste it here. In my case the mdf bed + thick acrylic build plate is quiet heavy, so these numbers are critical, otherwise it skips sometimes.

Nov 18, 2015 - Modified Nov 18, 2015

Hi Andreas, I want to attach the rods at two corners of the printer frame. This way it will be possible for me to use already existing infrastructure so I don't have to print more parts or drill/screw in the frame.

Do you think that a much longer version (on the diagonal) is going to bind or will the cantilevered free-corners be a problem?

Thanks.

So, I don't relly get your request, could you be more precise ?

I just printed the top spool parts and the spools, and the spools wont fit into the top parts, they are too wide.

Sorry about it, I^can't check it now, but I will ASAP

Nov 29, 2015 - Modified Nov 29, 2015
MonZon - in reply to andreasL

I've checked this - it's okay if your printer is tuned well. But for others - it would be good to have the top parts 0.5-1mm wider.

Other thing - I've printed those spools and mounted, but there is a diagonal line from the slider to the top part with spooled bearing. Which means that we will have different movement at the different heights with the same steps. To fix it we will need to move top bearings axis closer to the wall.

Or do I need to reprint the whole stuff?

You are right about the diagonal, but if you do the math, you'll find that the Z hysteresis caused by this geometry is not important. The X and Y axix suffer from the same problem, but it's not that important.

Anyway, if you want to correct it, you may start with the belts atachments on the sliders, but you should also move the corners bearing's axis to get the right alignment.

Nov 30, 2015 - Modified Nov 30, 2015
MonZon - in reply to andreasL

Dunno, but this geometry looks bad to me. Also it is getting stuck at the top position because of this. I'll try to investigate this more.

I'll try to move the bearing axis just on the top parts and see if it's doable.

Ok, i'm updating the full thing right now. You will have de files for the sliders in a moment ( 2 hours i think )
I'll also update the corners, but you won't have to re-print it if you don't want to.

Update done !

You may just reprint up parts, sliders and spools.

Great! Thanks a lot!
Could you please explain why I don't need to reprint the bottom corners?

yeah of course. I juste moved the bearings axis 1mm sideway, so if you dont use the 3 last cm of your Z axis you wont need to reprint it. Anyway, I may recomend to reprint those parts to... so you'll have the full release ;)

Think about printing the optional bearing parts ! ( i added a picture of what it looks likes)

Comments deleted.

Full upgrade feels much better to me) Thanks again for a quick fix.
I'll try to print them tonight if I'll manage to fix my Z axis somehow.

Also, the bearing on the motor plate is a wonderful idea, I'm on it! ))))

By zthe way,spools are only needed for the upper bearings and the optionnal 1 (3 spools in all)

Nov 4, 2015 - Modified Nov 4, 2015

One more question but an important one I guess for non-standard sized Smartrapcores.
I rendered the parts for the smartrapcore with a slighlty bigger print volume, not necessarily for printing bigger but to have more space in all directions if I choose to use a different hotend mount or a dual hotend. This way I have more clearance for extra stuff.
Currently it is:

Print width: 211mm
Print height : 205mm
Print depth : 208mm

That means that your wooden bed won't fit my build. I think that the print width determines the wooden bed length.
So could I just add these extra 11mm to the center of the print bed and adjust the mounting holes for the heatbed??
Without having the construction files this will become a game of guessing and hoping that the (adjusted) laser cut mdf bed fits the build.

Nov 4, 2015 - Modified Nov 4, 2015
andreasL - in reply to punkrockseb

Hello
sorry about these files, i have to change them. It seems that my printer ( one of the first smartrap core ) is not standard in width,

If I upload you a normalized file for the standard smartrapcore, will you be able to put it to scale ? ( AI file)

Hi.
My one is 250250250 volume build.
Once i print the part, i measure the distance between suport and take a piece of wood equal to measure.
I bet it work !

better use the drawing with measurment i posted in the pictures.

Nov 4, 2015 - Modified Nov 4, 2015
punkrockseb - in reply to andreasL

If that means that I just need to add the '+' size (like in my case 211mm instead of 200mm print width, so +11mm) somewhere in the Ai file then I am fine. That would be great.

I also think about building a standard smartrapcore. Meaning 200x200x200 (or 150mm for the Z axis as it is in the openjscad file by default) print folume (X/Y/Z)

I aded the promissed drowing :)

Comments deleted.
Nov 3, 2015 - Modified Nov 3, 2015

Question about top_left_spool.stl and up_l.stl ...
It looks like these are more or less the same. Which should we print and why did you add the top_left_spool.stl??

EDIT:
I need the slider with a 12mm-12.2mm hole for the bearing as I use sintered bearings. May you please upload an STEP or IGES file of it so I can modify it?

You should use Top *** spool parts + 2 bearing spools.

On the "up" parts, the belt was running directly on the bearing, and some misalignment may occur.

Can you link us up to your bearings ?

I'm going to make you a special part ;)

Nov 3, 2015 - Modified Nov 3, 2015
andreasL - in reply to andreasL

The file is on ;)

Print, enjoy and think about clicking the "i made one" button ;)

Woot that was fast. In the meantime I fired up fusion360 and managed to mod the stl file aswell and printed it. But that somehow is a real mess, working with brep converted mesh files.
12.2mm prints out just fine for the bearings.
Thanks!

These are the bearings: http://www.ebay.de/itm/161617346233?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Oct 8, 2015 - Modified Oct 8, 2015

I am interested in adding this to my recently finished SmartRap Core. However, I am a little confused as to what parts are needed. I have some beginner questions:

There is only one STL for the slider (other than the custom ones you made). Do we just print a mirror image of the one for the other side)?

The slider has a place to attach the belt integral to the part. But you also have the piece which screws in to attach the belt to. Is that simply in addition to the integral holder?

What are the additional pieces listed in the Thing Files? For example, the supprt_bed.STL and the tendeur_couroie.STL?

Oct 8, 2015 - Modified Oct 8, 2015
andreasL - in reply to MichaelBrock

Hello
The slider part is made in a way that you can use it on the left or the right, without any mirroring. Just print 2 parts !

Sliders have built in belt attachment. The part you are talking about ( Joint_couroie_corps and Joint_couroie_couvercle) are here to "close the loop" of your open belt (see pictures)

Support_bed are the 4 parts witch are screwd on the wooden bed to put the MK2 and the glass on (green on the CAD)
Tendeur_couroie is just a wave belt tensioner, to adjust the tension of your belt after you closed the loop

Feel free to ask anithing if it's still unclear to you. :)

Same with me - I see supprt_bed.STL, but I don't see the moving thing to hold the glass in place. Can you upload it? Thanks!

These moving parts are included in the Smartrap Core STL files here: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:651117/#files
it's in sc_12_plate2.stl

SmartrapCore

ok,tks !
I added "glass lock" part. :)

Thanks! Printed and happily using it =)

Do you plan on making version with the spools against belt rubbing on the bearings?

Nov 3, 2015 - Modified Nov 3, 2015
andreasL - in reply to MonZon

Thing was udpaded yesterday, witch spools ( print "top left spool" and "top right spool" + 2 bearing spools
its not needed on the "corner" parts, since there is no reason for the belt to slip off the bearings.

Please, add a "i made one" with some photos and a comment ;)

Comments deleted.

Hi.
Can i have a openjscad file for the slider ?
I would like to use LM10UU bearing instead LM08UU.

Thanks.

Hello,
Native files are solidworks models

There, i've uploaded a slider for the LM10.

Thank so much !!!

Salut Andreas,
Aurais-tu les fichiers source, car je voudrais adapter les chariots pour des douilles Igus à la place des LM08UU ?
(Dimensions des Igus RJMP-01-08 : D16*L25mm - D.int.8mm)
++JM

hello, je t'upload une version spéciale adapté de suite

C'est super gentil Andreas, grand merci à toi !

Voila qui est fait.

Pour info, ce design va bientot migrer sur onshape, et sera donc modifiable facilement par tout-un chacun. (c'estp our ca que je ne donne pas les sources )

Aug 26, 2015 - Modified Aug 26, 2015
J-Max - in reply to andreasL

Un grand merci à toi andreas ! C'est parfait ;)

OnShape le principe est bien mais 5 docs seulement par utilisateur ou 1200€ par an, ça fait mal !
Ou alors il faut avoir 250 comptes différents, mais ça aide pas un maker à se faire un nom ;)

Encore grand merci !

++JM

PS et j'oubliais, bravo pour ton travail et merci pour le partager.

5 documents actifs ! En fait le bridage est quasiment inexistant, et n empêche pas d avoir bcp plus de projets !

Merci pour la précision, je voyais ça plus restreint.

++JM

Have you had any issues with your carriages rubbing against the wooden frame?

Hello
nop, no problem with the carriage, there is not a lot of clearance, but far enough to me.

I meant with larger prints that are heavy, do the guide rods bow outward and cause the sliders to rub against the wall. Is that why you added the tab on the rear of the sliders? I ask beacuse i would like to use this Z carriage design to make a larger print bed

This should not happend !!
The tabs are meant to be able to put 2 m3 screw to tighten the lm08.

Bonsoir andreasL,
Quelles seraient les modifs à apporter pour un MQ3 vs MQ2. Il me semble qu'ils ont la même taille (214x214)....

Dans ce cas seul les supports du bed seraient à modifier, il me semble que le MK3 ne fait pas la même épaisseur que le MK2

OK merci

yee good idea... thanks for sharing..

This solution is awesome!!! Thank You for sharing.

Jun 24, 2015 - Modified Jun 25, 2015

Rooooooooooooooooooooo, punaise,,,, génial. Parce que quand tu tapes dans du 250x250 en plateau, le porte-à-faux, bonjour.
Merci.

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